Q & A with The Vet

Problem Feet

Hi Dr. Tom,

I have an 11 year old thoroughbred with more feet problems than I ever could have imagined. Currently we have hit a dead end because he has white line disease in a front and back foot which we have been chasing for 2 1/2 years now and it always comes back.  He also has navicular, moves on his toes and stumbles a lot at the walk.  He can no longer keep shoes on his feet, as there is not enough hoof wall to nail them to.  I have been looking into barefoot or natural trimming but I am scared to death to pull his shoes because he has very sensitive soles, has had beginning laminitis and is prone to quarter cracks.  I have been told boots are out of the question since we are going to have his
foot re-sectioned (re-scected, I'm not sure of the correct terminology) and it needs to be open to air. 

Our vet has been removing the pockets of white line disease.  Gelding is in a dry stall with a run, re-checked by the farrier every three weeks, and I clean the foot with miconosil spray daily.  Nothing works.  How can I get these shoes off him without devastating effects and how should he be trimmed?

I feel as if we are tampering with a time bomb.  Any suggestions will be greatly appreciated.  Thank you for your time.

Sincerely,
Amy

Hi Amy,

 

Quite an adventure you have going there with this horse!  Problems going on for years like this indicate improper remedies having been applied for years.  I would immediately stop using any farrier or veterinarian who has seen this horse before, and find someone dedicated to natural hoof care who can not only tell you how to treat the white line disease (this is easy to remedy compared to your other problems), but also fix you up with hoof boots that can be taken OFF and ON, instead of having the steel shoes in place which have destroyed the horse's hooves up to this point.  Visit EasyCare to learn more.

After dealing with infection, and allowing more normal circulation and sensation to return, your horse will begin to grow a more normal, stronger hoof.  To expect complete recovery in a case like this is too optimistic, but "complete recovery" means many different things to different people depending on what they use their horses for.  (He's not likely to win the Derby, but could probably end up outdoing many horses on trail rides.) 

 

You have nothing to lose by trying to find someone willing to take you and this horse as clients in natural hoof care, as it would seem at this point the horse is, and has been for years, on a sure road to destruction.  Some horses don't recover from such problems, but only because of improper and/or ignorant hoof care, nutrition, exercise and lifestyle.

 

I would NOT allow any resectioning of the hoof to be done for any reason.

 

I WOULD continue your research into natural hoof care, as you are finally on the right track for your horse.  Starting on an adventure which will be educational and real, rather than continuing in the one which has been killing your horse up to this point.  Lots of horses are in the same boat... the more you learn, the more you'll have huge "blind flashes of the obvious" in the weeks and months to come.

 

Type "natural hoof care" in to any search engine on your computer, and start reading.  Find someone in your area to help.  You could also bring the horse to me here in Arizona, but not sure where you live (although I've had horses come to me from all over the USA).

 

Keep your chin up.

 

Dr. Tom T.

Cancel the Surgery for My Very Navicular Horse

Dear Dr. Teskey,

My name is Mona Elston and I am ready to have my horse nerved this Tuesday.  After a year of “corrective” or “therapeutic” shoeing, my horse is still lame.  The thought of nerving him makes me sick to my stomach (especially after I read your article “Bringing the Sparkle Back in Crystal’s Life”.  My reason for nerving him is to get him out of pain and give him some quality of life– I have another horse I can ride.  I am just tired of seeing him in pain.  I bought him when he was 5 ½, he is now 7 and he was lame 30 days after I bought him.  I suspect they gave him a “30 day” injection in the bursa before they dumped him because the x-rays showed that the navicular disease had been there for some time.  I don’t have horse property so I have to board him so I am trying to do the best that I can do for him.  Is there any way I can call you for a phone consultation and if so, what is your fee?  I am at my wit’s end. 

Thank you.

M

Hi M,

There's an awful lot of information out there for you to read and explore.  As you've discovered, the surgery is simply a "cover up" for your horse's real problems.  You'll need to find someone in your area that is familiar with natural hoof care and can help you with getting some hoof boots.  Or, you can simply get some boots yourself as a very good start.  By exercising your horse in boots with the metal shoes pulled off, you may very well notice improvement immediately.  Visit EasyCare's website  to look at the various boots available.  Either the "Epic" boots or the "Old Mac" boots would likely work well for you.  Read Pete Ramey's website if you haven't already, as well as continue to do computer searches and find other sites that have good information.  Many sites have lists of trimmers by region.  Do a search for "natural hoof care trimmer" to find some of these- Click here is a to see a good one.

 

You're on the right track.  Keep up your research.  Get some boots BEFORE pulling the shoes- then get the horse's shoes pulled off. Do NOT have the horse trimmed at this time.  Walk/ride your horse with the boots on and you'll likely notice improvement very quickly, as metal shoes are not only painful for a horse but PREVENT healing instead of helping like many professionals will tell you.

 

Take care,

Dr. Tom T.

 

Dr. Teskey,

Thank you very very much.  I have canceled the nerving and I will try pulling Ziggy’s shoes and putting on the Old Macs and find a certified barefoot trimmer.  It can’t do any more harm and if nothing else, I am hoping it will help.  Nerving is definitely not the answer. 

Thank God I found your website and learned more about the nerving procedure.  It sounds like I dodged a bullet.

Thank you for your time,

M

Good for you, Mona.  I believe you'll have good success, and learn some very cool things over the next few months.  Knowledge is empowering and you and your horses will be better for it.

Dr. T

Could you advise on my horse, Joe?

Hi Dr. T,

 

Long time no chat. I would like to run an interesting horse by you.

 

Joe is a 6 year old QH paint from out west.  He was shod for the last 7 months, here in SE Pennsylvania.  During the spring, he was slightly off, first on RF, then LF.  He took the summer off. Body worker recommended he go barefoot.  I trimmed him today for the 3rd time.  Although his foot is round, concavity forming nicely, nice frogs, great horn quality, his toes are long and his heels are under-run.  He wears Old Mac's G2 hoof boots with half inch Comfort Pads.

 

Lifestyle: Turned out for the day time and in at night, "the winter schedule", with a small herd in a nice sized pasture.  Food is fine. Owner does Parelli on ground and riding about 5 days per week. They have a soft arena and cross county.  I am not sure owner can talk barn manager into leaving him out at night with a friend, but that would be my recommendation.  He is a bit chubby but not laminitc.

 

He was diagnosed with Lyme disease (apparent in most of our horses) but because of his lameness issues is being treated with an antibiotic.  Owner is supplementing with a pro-biotic.

 

Today, I trimmed him and he is off on the soft arena and firm grass.  The vet was visiting and called him foot sore. (I don't agree.  To me foot sore horses can walk in soft terrain but not on gravel and rocks)  The vet wants to shoe him then block him to see where the problem lies.  She thinks shoes will take the "foot sore" variable out of the mix.

 

He is 99% sound with padded boots.  The vet said it's barely perceptible.  I forget your rating system but the number where only a professional will notice it.

 

So my common sense tells me that the long toes and under run heels may have taken their toll on his tendons and joints during his 6 years.  I would recommend as much sound movement as possible, avoiding whatever bothers him, like small circles.  Given his age, I would expect him to work thru this period.  He is trimmed every 4 weeks.  I do Pete Ramey's trim but leave the walls just a nick over the sole, not an eighth of an inch.

 

Your comments are most welcome and don't worry about contradicting my "common sense".  I am a lifelong student.

 

Thanks, as always for all your help.

 

Dawn

Hi Dawn,

As you are likely aware, horses recently out of shoes like this can have multiple issues.  You're still in that real touchy time- we underestimate how many changes are occurring in horses like this.  You mention seeing some concavity developing, but this is not likely the case.  It is concavity that is already there.  It may disappear with coming out of shoes and the capsules collapsing, especially with some laminitis.  I think you are correct in thinking it is a problem.  I don't think we can expect to see honest, new concavity developing in laminitic cases until the walls are nearly grown out.  Often times you'll maintain concavity and never lose it if laminitis is kept at bay.

If your horn quality is as good as you say coming out of shoes, it should be phenomenal next year.

Wonder what the Lyme is doing/has done to his connective tissue/metabolism/soundness?

Certainly the long toe/low heel adds some fierce stresses to the legs and joints.  Your plan sounds prudent- as much sound movement as possible will heal the horse to the best of his ability.  Well, not quite that good with the stalling at night, but pretty good.

See how it goes.  Horses need at least one to two years to fully recover from the negative effects of shoeing, so long term planning is always a good bet.

Dr. Tom

Surgical Arthrodesis and Natural Hoof Care

Dear Dr. Teskey:

I believe I have an interesting case, and wondered if you could answer some questions for me.

SURGICAL FUSION AND RINGBONE.  This past May, a vet school performed arthrodesis on my upper level dressage gelding for high ringbone.  Prior to having the surgery, it was clear that he would not be sound without the surgery, so I felt I had no choice except to go ahead with the fusion.  He now has a plate and 6 screws placed in his pastern.  Up until the time he came up lame, he had been shod regularly.

Up until recently, I was comforted by studies that I found online, and by the confidence of the ortho surgeon at the school that horses that are fused have a high % chance of returning to the level of work they were at prior to the injury.  These papers reported that the pastern is a low motion joint, with little to no movement, so fusion would not affect the gait, so I felt sure that my horse's beautiful movement would not be affected by fusing that joint.  That was the least of my concerns -- it was surviving the surgery, the cast and getting through post surgical recovery and stall rest without further injury.  Which did!  My horse has an incredible and strong spirit and was the world's best patient!  My concern is this:

1. I am trying to recover his foot and am dedicated to the idea of staying barefoot.  I believe that the ringbone that exists in the other leg (though minor) would only be accelerated by putting restrictive metal on his feet.
2. I am trying to rehab the horse physically from the surgery at the same time I am trying to grow a normal foot on him.  Heʼs foot sore from crossing the gravel, crushed stone driveway to go out to his paddock and he is obviously heel sore from having his heels lowered to get contact with the ground.
3. When we fitted him with Old Macʼs last night, he was markedly improved when we put comfort pads in the boots with the frogs cut out.  However, he looks like he has a bucket on the end of each foot and Iʼm worried about the effect that more than 1 pound on the end of each leg is going to have on the arthrodesis.

My additional concern is about return to movement:

I spoke to the surgeon about my concerns, and he once again assured me that my horse is going to have his full range of movement and be as good as he was prior to the lameness.  He said that it is too early to expect him to be moving well; to expect periodic lameness, that there is a lot of soft tissue inflammation which will cause him to be a bit choppy, and not show suspension.  That naturally he is being guarded with himself because of the insult to his limb.  My vet feels that there is every reason to feel confident that my horse will return to his former capabilities; that he in fact is way ahead in his recovery than most horses would be.  (This horse is tough btw).  Now while I do see daily improvement with respect to strength and balance - still, when I ride those few steps of trot, I think OH MY GOD, this isn't the same horse.

My question is:  If that joint is fused, can a horse regain his suspension and thrust off the ground, his spring?  Can I hope for a return to dressage training?  This horse was a fabulous and flamboyant mover and I'd only imported him a couple of years ago.  He really has made incredible strides in his recovery and the surgeon is VERY optimistic.  But as I said, these recent reports have me alarmed that, although I think he'll be sound, he won't have the impulsion and suspension he had before the fusion.

Can you give me your thoughts on arthrodesis and loss of movement in that joint - how will that affect a good moving dressage horse? Can you give me your thoughts on the road Iʼm traveling to recover a good foot, on the proper boots to be using and whether or not they might have a detrimental affect on my horseʼs fused joint?

Thanks so much!

Chris

Hi Chris,

 

Sounds like quite the adventure you're having with this horse.  If you're working with someone knowledgeable, you're way ahead of the game.  I would trust their judgment as long as they have some experience.  About all I can tell you, without consulting directly with you, is that you'll likely have several months or even a couple of years getting this horse going.  There's a lot that's happened "wrong" to this horse from the sounds of it, but now that you're going a better direction, progress should be more the norm.  I would be surprised if the horse can be 100% given what he's been through, but he may not need to be "100%" to do what you want to do.  Lower level performance is still an achievement- I don't think any horse with a fused pastern can perform as well as a horse with a normal joint.  If the surgeon is so optimistic, he/she must have a good reason.  Are they aware of your decision to be rebellious and make your horse work on his own feet?      

 

Using hoof boots is not a problem.  Think about how heavy some of those crazy "corrective" shoes with pads weigh!  I would defer to your trimmer again on use of boots and which kinds will work best on your horse with his specific problems.  Using boots is very important.

 

Keep up the good work.  Sounds like a lucky horse to have found you.

 

Dr. TT

Is There Ever A Reason to Shoe a Horse?

Greetings Dr. Teskey

I asked at my vet's office about shoeing.  The woman in his office said that it depends on what job the horse will be doing as well as the hoof integrity as to shoe or not shoe a horse. 

 

I also read an article that followed that line of thought.  From your articles I have read, and from current science research, horses don't need shoes.

 

Dr. Teskey, is there ever any reason to shoe a horse?

I want to remove the front shoes on my new 6yo mare and am afraid I going to be told  "she needs shoes".

 

Thanks for your help and for ALL THE EFFORT  and WORK you do to educate horse people.

 

Mary

Hi there,

 

The short answer to your question, for me, is NO.

 

I'm attaching an article ("The Unfettered Foot; A paradigm change for equine podiatry") for you to read, since you'll soon be visiting your veterinarian.  It has some food for thought for you.  Maybe your veterinarian would also like a copy.

Dr. Tom T.

 

Continuing Problems With My Barefoot Horse

Dear Dr. Teskey,

I have two problems I hope you can give me insight on.  The first is scratches possibly caused by the use of hoof boots.  The second is heel height and frog/digital cushion development.

I emailed you last winter because my horse, who had been barefoot since Sept. 2006, was very hoof sore.  At your suggestion, I used Easyboot Bares every time I rode him and used the thick comfort pads.  He did well with the boots and pads at home but had severe problems on the 2 multi-day endurance rides we did.

The obvious problem was that the boots just didn't fit him well.  At the ride in January, I poured at least 1/4 cup of grit, dirt and sand out of each boot at the end of the day.  This was after using vet wrap, duct tape and plumber's putty.  In addition to the dirt in the boots, the comfort pads had gotten folded in half horizontally underneath his sole and were ruined.  Then, on top of all that, he got a bad case of scratches.  I had only planned to do the first 2 days of the ride which was good because there was no way he could have done the third day. The scratches cleared up quickly (within a week) once we got home.

My second concern is that his frogs and contracted heels have not changed since I pulled his shoes last fall.  As you suggested, I used the hoof boots all winter to cushion his tender feet and he did well here at home. My trimmer, who has trimmed lots of barefoot horses, but isn't really trained, won't lower the heels, saying the hoof angle has to match the pastern angle.  I read quite a bit about trimming but still don't feel like I know much of anything.  Unfortunately, there is no well trained hoof trimmer near me that I know of.  I have a rasp and hoof stand and am quite willing to do what I can.

Even though the scratches are frustrating and I fear may end our endurance career, I am just as concerned about helping my horse's hooves to develop in a healthy direction.  Other horses that he lives with are doing just fine barefoot and have large, healthy looking frogs.  So, now I'm searching for what I need to do to help my horse get there too.

I really would appreciate any insight you can give!

Thanks,
L

Dear L,

Mostly it sounds like you need to ride barefoot more and condition the horse's hooves to do endurance barefoot, as I think you're right about the pastern wraps and the scratches.  This can be serious, so I wouldn't keep using the tape and wrapping above the boot that was contributing to that problem.  It also sounds like you've done too much/demanded too much of the horse early on.  Conditioning on the right terrain (not gravel) as well as keeping the horse in a good environment are the most important things.  Along with diet.

Decontraction of hooves is a mighty slow process, or doesn't happen at all many times coming out of shoes, since it's the BONES that are misshapen. Give it at least two years before deciding there will or won't be decontraction.

Keep up the good work,

Dr. TT

Better Off Barefoot

The Natural Hoof Care Advantage

Natural horsemanship practices today go hand in hand with natural hoof care—together they are unbeatable!   

Click here to read the entire article!

If you have a question for Dr. Tom you can email him or post a comment here and he will respond as soon as he can.

FREEDOM FOR THE FEET : Stepping out of steel shoes in style

We are intertwined, heart, mind and soul with these animals.

They perform for us with a work ethic rarely seen in human circles, and become capable of so much more when we allow their feet to function properly.

Click here to read the rest of this article by Dr. Teskey.

What Point Do you Recommend Booting Behind?

Hi, I have just started doing LD 30 endurance rides with my six year old paint who has always been barefoot. I boot him in the front, Easyboot Epics or Easyboot Bares and leave him bare behind for the rides. I only boot him at home if we're going to be doing a lot of trotting on dirt roads. He does still get ouchy on gravel. At what point would you recommend booting behind? I would like to do a fifty at some point but am concerned that's too far without hind boots. We live and ride mostly in New England. Can I use an Epic or Bare behind or is it best to foam a boot on so there is no gaiter? Thanks for any suggestions.

Mary

Hi Mary,

In your sport, and with most every other horse, the hind hooves work harder than the front hooves. Why is it, then, that we find ourselves having to boot the front hooves instead of the hind hooves? Seems like this is opposite of what we would think or what we “expect”! We use boots more often on our horses’ front hooves because our horses have more problems up front, not behind. Their hind hooves are stronger and sounder because they work harder. Front hooves “need” boots because they are not as sound as the hind hooves. This is the bottom line: front hooves are more unsound in our horses because of lack of movement/work throughout their lives. Even the smaller amount of movement our horses achieve in confinement allows their hind hooves to become stronger and healthier because they work harder than the front ones. And the ironic part of all of this is that when we shoe just the front hooves, we make the problems up front even worse. Using boots excessively up front can also lead to problems—taking time to ride more on surfaces that are comfortable for your horse without using boots is better than riding on rugged areas that require their use. If you can ride on really rough terrain without boots on the hind hooves, your horse has exceptional hind hooves.  Now you just need to strive to improve the problems up front and ride more on those surfaces that are comfortable so that the front hooves become more callused and tougher and healthier. That being said, I would always protect those weaker front hooves with boots on gravel and rocky terrain, so you don’t add insult to injury. Hoof rehab is a long term and life-long endeavor for many of our horses that haven’t had proper room to grow up with. Allowing young horses freedom of movement from birth is the only way to go in the future.  Soundness is rarely a problem in such horses that have been raised correctly from the day they were born.  That’s the best insurance a horse can get.

So, where does this leave you and others with the horses and your sports? First of all, we need to constantly strive to improve our horses’ living areas to maximize the mileage they put on every day. Many of us ride every day, but what about every NIGHT? Horses will put on a huge amount of movement at night if given a chance, but not if they are “put up” in the stable or stall or left in small turnouts or runs. They must be allowed to be in at least arena-sized areas WITH OTHER HORSES whenever we aren’t riding/training. If a horse is raised appropriately, they will more likely need boots on their hind hooves instead of their front hooves on rough terrain. How many horses do you know where this is the case? The only ones I’ve seen are ones raised on rough terrain from the day they were born as well as the young adopted mustang horses that aren’t confined once they reach their new home. When you do have to consider booting the hind hooves, all the normal considerations apply: proper sizing is the key, and the Epics or Bares will do just fine. There are lots of tips and tricks for fitting on the EasyCare website and on the other blogs on the site.

That’s a bit long-winded for me in answering your questions, but I think it’s important for all of us to get to the deeper causes of some of these common problems and start to think about things from the horse’s point of view.

Dr. Tom T.

Need To Use Boots?

Hi,

 

I am new to barefoot having recently bought a youngster who has never been shod.  However, she did have slightly neglected feet with a lot of flare and overgrowth on the inside of the fronts but normal wear on the outside, this had caused a toe crack in both front feet.  After one pasture trim with my farrier I have started caring for her feet myself however, I am concerned that apart from a little at the heels there never seems to be any wall growth.  I am only using the rasp to tidy up the outside edge of the walls, remove a little off the heels and keep the remaining flare tidy on the insides.  I can see improvement in her stance and she is certainly sound on the road and gravel driveway.  The toe cracks are not getting any worse.  She is currently ridden 2-3 times a week on the road for 40-60 minutes each time and is out at grass the majority of the time.  I do bring her in for about 4 hours each afternoon.  Her feet are quite flat and I can see sole callous on them.  She also is wearing the hoof wall at the toe more, at first this was on the outside but now does seem to be becoming more even.  I am concerned that if I start to ride her more I will over wear her feet and don't know how to tell if this is happening and if I need to use boots.  I have always been used to seeing shod horses and it seems very strange to look at her feet and see that she is clearly walking on a large area of her soles.  I know there is a ways to go with her feet.  There is still a lot of misshaped hoof on the inside walls that doesn't show in the pictures.

 

My main concerns are over wearing the feet, how to keep them mustang rolled when they are already so short and whether boots will cause unnecessary strain elsewhere if she doesn't really need them.

 

I have now pulled the shoes on my other horse and am transitioning him in boots partly due to the fact that after riding the mare barefoot I could feel every bone shaking step in the metal shoes but also because her feet stood up to the wet winter mud so much better.  In fact every time I see a shod horse now the feet just look all wrong.  He has to wear boots because his feet are weak from shoeing but I don't like the bulkiness of them, on the flat he strides out really well but going uphill they really seem to make the pasterns clunk.

 

S

Hi S,

 

It certainly sounds like you're on the right track with the horses and hooves.  I think you'd be happy with a pair of boots, especially if you insert a pad inside that will massage and stimulate the soles and frog.  There's some dome-shaped comfort pads that EasyCare is currently testing.  Click here to read how you can test out a pair of these new pads.  I've noted a much faster return to better form and function when using the pads inside the boots.  Other than that, it'll just take some more time for the hooves to toughen up.  When it's rainy/wet, make sure you've got an area the horses can keep out of the mud, as standing in the wet will set you back.  Also, over time the bones inside the hooves will be positioned higher, allowing you to keep your toe roll in better shape due to better solar concavity.  Keep up the good work!

 

Dr. TT