Q & A with The Vet

Converting 4 year old gelding to barefoot

Q:  My 13 year old daughter has a 4 year old gelding who went lame in November after pulling his shoes.  I don't have a prior history on him, but x-rays showed no rotation.  He was very sore for a few months, and then seemed to get better.  She has been round penning and lunging him for the past month, sometimes with some aggressive turns, stops and backs.  She had not ridden him until tonight.  Immediately, when she pushed him into a trot, I knew he was sore on the front.  His front hooves are not wearing evenly, with his (most) sore foot measuring 31/2" and his least sore measuring 31/4."  The vets nor the farrier can find anything wrong, and I am about to pull my hair out.  He looks flat across the front of the hoof, with his heels looking under run, almost like a duck bill, with some flaring out to the sides.  When his shoes were pulled in Nov, his soles dropped to the ground, and are just getting some concavity back to them.  My farrier is doing a 4pt trim with him, but it doesn't seem to be helping.  Any ideas or recommendations?  I can't get the Epics on him, as the clips interfere with the fit, and due to the conformation and flaring out to the side.  Any help would be appreciated, as I am to the point of putting shoes back on the boy.  He is my daughter's best friend, so I have to help him, no matter what!  Thanks in advance for your response. 

A: Young horses like this really get in trouble sometimes with their coffin bones and soft tissue in the heels of their hooves when having shoes so young, as they aren't finished growing.  These structures get very pinched early on and don't end up reaching the size they should have reached, so you often have a permanently diminished size along with the damage.  They usually do pretty well but only reach a certain level of performance due to their smaller hooves before needing some good boots to help them along.

Four point trimming is not the most complementary way to shape a hoof.  If you look at the trim manual I have for download off the EasyCare's website you may note some important differences.  You can flatten out the metal prongs in those boots, or your farrier can easily help with that.  Perhaps the farrier would also like to read the trim manual to learn some more things about the hooves, too.

Read as much as you can before you make a decision to shoe the horse again (www.hoofrehab.com, www.equinextion.com, www.equethy.com).  The damage done already would only continue to worsen if you go back to the shoeing that caused it in the first place.  Given enough time and movement and proper trimming, most horses will come around nicely.

Transitioning 5 year old paint to barefoot

Q: Story: I have a 5 year old paint that I recently rescued from a life in a 10x10 stall and no exercise whatsoever.  He had not been trimmed in a long time, and had long toes, heels fine, but all feet slightly turn out (legs are straight).  I had him trimmed by a knowledgeable shoer who brought his ankles up, left lots of heel and had him at about 58 in the front and a few degrees diff in rear.  I painted his feet with turpentine, and worked him daily trotting in our round pen and on hard and soft surfaces.  He was great, then began getting ouchy, then went totally lame. X rays show lollipop lesions and a cyst on his right navicular bone.  Left was fine.  Granted, the lameness didn't show until he had about 4 weeks of work on him after his trim.  I read a ton, and decided to try and boot him with neoprene pads on the bottom with Boa boots when I ride, and just asked the shoer to come look at him and trim if he needed to get his angles equal.  The horse had significant pink in his white line (bruising?), the shoer got him lined up with his shoulder and pastern, and made him equal at 60 in fronts and I believe 58 in rears.  Short toes, left heel, but did take out more sole and bars than I would have liked.  Anyway, the horse does fine in his boots some days appearing 100% sound, but without the boots, he walks around like he is on eggshells and varies which foot he favors the most.  His corral is with one other horse, and they are fairly active.  I trot him at least 15-20 minutes in his boots daily or ride him with them on for longer.  I have been painting his feet (bottoms) as was recommended to me to help toughen them to our terrain.  He is not working on rocks at all, just hard packed dirt mostly.  I have been told that I should work him only in boots, to reduce the concussion and help him to not wear his feet in a odd way because of the soreness.  I have also been told to work him barefoot daily to help him increase blood flow and develop the inner structures of the hoof.  Mind you, this horse had no medical care or maintenance whatsoever before we purchased him.  Should I leave him booted while working him?  Should I boot him during the day and take them off at night?  Should I keep painting his feet?  Should I not let the shoer trim him and just trim the outer wall myself when it comes time? I have read several books on it and feel like I could do it.  I just want to minimize soft tissue damage and get rid of his pain.  He has not developed any outward signs of "navicular."  His heels are not contracted, has no club foot or anything, but the pink in his whiteline when he was trimmed looked painful, and I had never seen anything like it.  What do you recommend?

A: Sounds like you've got an interesting horse there that is a bit of a challenge.  Horses kept confined like that often have very underdeveloped cartilage and digital cushion in their heel areas.  I agree with you that using boots while working is a very good idea.  I'm concerned that the angles you're reporting are pretty high (though I don't put too much stock in hoof wall angles, these sound extremely high.  The heel height and depth of toe are much more important measurements).  If you'd like to send me some snapshots of the hooves I'd be happy to comment more specifically on them.  In the meantime, you can see some pretty good pic's of hooves on Pete Ramey's site at www.hoofrehab.com, as well as www.equinextion.com and www.equethy.com.  Appropriate heel height is critical for setting the whole process of hoof function off correctly.  Excess height like I suspect in this case, will certainly cause the bruising you're seeing at the white line as well as worsen the degeneration of the heel/navicular areas.  I think you certainly could learn some simple trimming and keep this horse going in the right direction.  Getting the heel height correct first will be critical.  Do you have someone in your area knowledgeable about natural hoof care that could take a look for you?  Send those pictures if you like.

Heel height on mule feet

Q: I just read one of your articles and I had a question.  I have a four year old mule and she did not have shoes on when I got her two years ago.  I did take them off during the winter about a year ago and then put them back on last year because my vet said she was getting low in her heels.  They have been on since, however last month she lost a front shoe and I wanted to go for a little trail ride in the field and I could really tell the difference on the foot without the shoe and the one with the shoe (how much smoother it was).  The question I guess I have is, are they lower in the heel when the shoes are off?  She lives outside year round unless I go to a show or the weather is bad.  I live in SC.  Her feet seem pretty hard it did not seem to bother her that her shoe was not on.  I wish I had not put them on, but everyone said oh you need them if you trail ride and this and that.  I mostly show English and go on some trail rides, but mostly walking on the trails unless it has good footing to trot or canter.

Thanks for any advice you could give me.  I just know from feeling the difference that it would be better for her it was like one foot was in sand and the other hitting concrete. 

A: Many farriers and veterinarians have this incorrect belief that mules and donkeys should have high heels.  This is an error that has caused a great amount of discomfort in these animals for a long time.  Heel height in these animals is most often quite similar to horses, though the hoof shape is more upright with bigger frogs.  I have yet to meet a mule that didn't EXCEL being barefoot.  To shoe these animals is a real disservice to their natural hybrid abilities.

Transitioning 12 year old TB to barefoot

Q: I have a 12 year old thoroughbred gelding who has had shoes on since he started training at the age of 3.  He was an excellent dressage and eventing horse until he had an injury to the left front tendon two years ago. Recently, he has been unsound in several areas.  Some days, it's the left front, other days it's the left hind, etc.  So, I was advised to give him a minimum of 6 months pasture rest.  After being out for two weeks, he lost a shoe in the deep mud.  I decided after doing a little internet research, that pulling his shoes would be the best solution.  I figured that since the ground was so soft this time of year and he had room to roam, pain wouldn't be too big of a problem.  The owner of the pasture however, calls me every few days telling me that he is "dead lame" and can barely walk. She also says that when it's cold in the mornings, he shakes a bit.  It only gets down to about 30 degrees at night, which is why I’m wondering if that's what's making the pain worse.  The last time I went out to visit him, which was a day after I got the first call, he was galloping around with the rest of the herd and looked very happy.  I am concerned about the amount of pain he is in when I'm not around.  I would like to know how long to expect him to be in pain, how long does the average horse take to toughen up?"  Will he toughen up eventually?  If he doesn't seem to rehabilitate, do I put front shoes back on?  Do I give him bute in the meantime?  I am so clueless!!!  Any advice you have would be GREATLY appreciated. Thanks for your time.
 
A: There are some excellent websites with all the answers to your questions.  Which are good ones but ones that have a lot of "it depends" sort of answers.  Keep in mind that your horse's hooves are likely quite unhealthy and damaged from the years of shoeing, and especially from such a young age.  I feel for you in this time of transition.  The more you read and learn about the hoof, the more you'll understand why horses act the way they do when we ask them to be without shoes.  You would think they could simply "walk around on their own feet" and be fine, but the damaging effects of shoes over the years prevent them from even doing such simple things.  Do a quick internet search for "natural horse trim" or "barefoot horse" and all your answers are there.  I could write back and forth with you for weeks on end on this subject, but you'll pick it all up quicker by reading the good stuff out there.

Turnout, or confinement?

Q: He was VERY hyper today, but is usually a very calm horse.  (He has a girlfriend now - a mare is sharing his area now.)  I put him in the large sand arena (which I haven't done - keep him out of sand and just on fairly soft but firm trail walk).  He did do a little bit of trotting and cantering but I didn't want him to hurt himself, just calm down a bit.  His head slightly bobbed (two months ago it was a serious bob, now slight).  Is this bad for him to run in the arena?  What if he has the Old Macs on?  I didn't let him do too much because I didn't know if this was bad for him or not.  Is it okay to let him run around in there or is that really bad right now?  Thank you I appreciate your input.

A: I leave it up to the horse whether they feel like they can trot and/or canter around.  Sometimes they "pay for it" with more sensitivity the next day or two, but I haven't seen any real self-destructing problems from this.  I know that many DVM's and others think that horses will self-destruct if we "allow" them to run around.  This is nonsense for the most part.  They desperately need to be a horse and it is a critical part of their rehabilitation to be able to "run around".  We should not be "stall resting" horses 99% of the time that we do.  THIS is what is destructive to the horse, and I've got dozens of examples to prove this and can also point to hundreds more horses that are degenerating right before their owner's eyes simply because they lock them up.  Their dogs have more room to run than their horses!

Make sense?  I can be pretty opinionated on this sort of thing.  That's because I'm right on when it comes to the nature of the horse.  :)

That would be fine to keep the boots on him the first few times he wants to run around.  Nothing wrong with that.

Take care,

Dr. TT

Breaking Traditions

Q: I have just read your article on 'Breaking Traditions' on steel shoes.  I agree whole heartedly with you!

I have an 18 year old 16.3 hands Thoroughbred gelding.  He has had shoes on his whole life and for the last 8 months egg bar shoes on the back.  I have now decided to let him be a horse and have taken his shoes off.  All four at once.  Silly perhaps, I should have taken the back off first and later the front. But hindsight is 20/20.

The shoes have been off a week and my horse has been in terrible pain and unable to walk properly since they came off.  Should I persevere and keep them off or put them back on?  How long will his feet take to stop being sore?  Is it worth it for him?  I feel like I'm torturing my horse!  He looks like a foal who is unsure if his legs belong to him and he is very sore.  I have put him on a painkiller and anti-inflammatory for 3 days and the vet is coming to check him tomorrow.  Please help! 

A: That's pretty cool that your veterinarian is supporting you.  So many people not only have to "go it alone" without their vet's, but hear them constantly ridiculing them as well.

I would say that boots would be in order, and I don't think going without them is necessarily good.  This is a transition time, and the "cold turkey" approach isn't necessarily going to be good for the horse.  Too much unnecessary pain.  Boots are NOT going to keep your horse from making progress, as there are lots of tissues INSIDE the hooves that need to heal as well, not just like the outsides.
 
Three months is a good amount of time for progress, but not near enough time for full healing.  I'm sure you've come across data that talks about how long it takes for a hoof to grow out all the way, etc. 

Good for you for sticking it out.  Click here to check out the various boots at EasyCare, because you're going to need to use something on those hooves that were shod for so long.  I really don't think it's good to go with nothing and force them to "get tough or die."  The boots are perfect for transitioning these horses to eventually being barefoot all the time. 

Dr. TT

Painful time converting to barefoot

Q: I had my vet come out yesterday to evaluate my horse and decide whether I was torturing him or not.  There is severe bruising on the toe of each front hoof, just off the centre line.  The bruising is bad and when my poor horse walks on a stone it causes him pain which is why he is willing and able to walk out better on the grass than on the stony road.

My vet has advised me to not put shoes back on or to put boots on as the feet will not get strong then and the last few weeks of pain will all be for nothing.  He says that if ever in the future I took them off again we would go through the same process.  So we have decided to give my horse 3 months to see whether or not he will be able to cope barefoot.  It is possible that his feet will just be too soft and that he will continually bruise and then front shoes will be necessary, although I may then get boots for him to wear during the day as apposed to nailing shoes on.

My horse has been on bute since Monday and will come off it tomorrow, so we'll see how he is on Sunday once it is out of his system.  I also have him on Tissue Salts to try and help his body cope.  I will walk him out a lot (walking with him - no riding) to try and help the circulation and the healing process.

Other wise for now I am taking it one moment at a time and trusting that my horse's feet will be able to revert to the way his body needs them to be. I have to try barefoot for his sake.  But after 16 years of abuse with shoes I only hope that we will be able to overcome the soreness that he is experiencing now.  He has four white feet which make it harder for him.

He is my whole world and I would do anything for him which is why I am able to let him try barefoot, even though it breaks my heart to see him in pain and I feel guilty about it every second.  But I need to be strong for him.

I have heard that it very unusual for vets to advocate barefoot but would like to let you know that it is growing.  My vet is one of the few who know it is best for horses.

I also think that many people take shoes off their horses but cannot face the pain that their horses experience and then put shoes quickly back on.  I know I was ready to last Saturday.  But I'm giving it a shot for my horse's sake.  I just hope he knows that I would never want to hurt him and why I have allowed him to be so sore!

Thank you for responding to my emails.  It is much appreciated!

Keep up the good work!  There are millions of horses who need your help!

A: Well, horses like yours are the reason that I write about what I do.  The damage is severe and it may or may not be "worth it" for your horse. You should have boots to put on your horse before you try to pull shoes like that.  Do you have any available?  If not, go to EasyCare's website and order some Boa Boots in the right size for your horse.  Also, you need to read some more stuff and get yourself up to speed on what is happening with your horse.  Do a search for barefoot horses or natural trim on the computer or go to www.equethy.com, www.hoofrehab.com and www.equinextion.com for starters.

I sympathize with you and your horse.  It's a terrible thing that we have to face and learn about what we've done to them, and vow not to treat our young horses this way.

Best wishes.  Keep in touch if you like and I can try to help you along.

Dr. Tom T.

Removing steel shoes

Q: I am purchasing two horses.  Both have steel shoes.  When do I have them removed, and what do I do or don't do once they are removed??  Do I ride or not ride for awhile??  I agree with the natural horse foot.  It is like a human walking on cement for a long time.  OUCH!!

A: I would have the shoes removed close to the time when they would be ready to be trimmed.  Probably a month or two after the present shoes were put on.  When you take them off I would NOT have them trimmed at all.  Leave them a little long footed to begin with, because many times the weak structure will break away.  If you trim them after removing the shoes, they'll often be unnecessarily sensitive.  I would have them out where they can move around at will and ride them right away if they are walking without sensitivity on smooth ground.  You might want to get a couple of boots for the front feet so that you can ride them as they are recovering from the damage of the shoes.  Click here to visit EasyCare's website.  I like the Boa Boots myself.  Congratulations on choosing good, natural hoof care for your horses.

Take care,

Dr. TT

Hoof damage

Q: The photos attached are of my horse's near front hoof.  My gentle giant (TB/warmblood cross) has pretty ugly feet.  Splayed out pancakes with run under heels.  After putting up with an on-again-off-again lameness issue in one hoof that couldn't be diagnosed, and led to pulling and re-shoeing numerous times in succession, I finally pulled shoes totally about 7 months ago to see what barefoot would bring. X-rays at the start showed dangerously thin soles (1/4inch).  The transition was tough but after using boots for a few months he's calloused up and moving comfortably without boots.  New x-rays show 1/2 inch soles.  So the soles are going in the right direction!  And there is at least some concavity coming. But the lameness in this one hoof has not resolved itself. 

In the photos, you'll see we've found a crack from the heel toward the frog that also includes a non-typical "fold" of hoof growth.  The latest vet to see him thinks it may be an old injury.  He suggests cutting that fold away to see what's under it.  After transitioning to barefoot successfully and dealing with thin soles, I'm not anxious to cut away at hoof growth, but it may be the best idea we have.  Do you agree it looks like an old injury?  Given the thin soles, would you cut away at that fold?

I really love this horse and would like him to be sound enough for low level dressage and fun trail rides. In the year and a half I've owned him he's been periodically lame in this foot, noticeably worse when he circles with that foot (surprisingly!) to the outside.

Any suggestions would be much appreciated.

A: I think (though might think differently if I saw the horse in person) that this spot is due to previous injury at the coronet, and that it very well be better to keep it trimmed so it is not taking primary weight bearing pressure.  The hoof in general is also pretty ugly as you have said, and you all have a ways to go.  Probably two or three hoof cycles to be sure, before you know what you'll have.  Damage of this degree is hell to deal with.

Dr. Tom T.